Watch, Read: Inside Col. Hague’s Space Mission
June 4, 2025
Col. Nick Hague joined AFA on June 4, 2025, for an Air & Space Warfighters in Action event to reflect on his six-month mission aboard the International Space Station. He shared how partnerships between NASA and the Space Force are shaping the future of space operations, how his military background prepared him to adapt through shifting crew dynamics, and why space exploration remains a critical frontier for national defense.
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This transcript was generated with the assistance of AI. Please report inconsistencies to comms@afa.org.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Welcome to the Air & Space Warfighters in Action. I’m Larry Stutzreim. I’m the Executive Vice President of the Air & Space Forces Association. And this is a special day you’re all a part of. We have our first live audience for war fighters in action, and we’ve got a large audience online listening. Also, we’re broadcasting from, Pentagon Row, that’s in Arlington, Virginia.
We’re just across the street from the Pentagon. Now before we get started, I want to give a deep heartfelt thanks to our industry sponsors who make warfighter in action a reality. And they’re on the board behind me. You can take a look at that, but I also want to give them a heartfelt thank because they directly support our nation’s guardians and airmen.
So with that, let’s get started. I’d like to welcome Colonel Nick Hague. He’s a distinguished and decorated NASA astronaut, but also equally important. He is a guardian, a Space force guardian, and we’ll talk a little bit about that as we go further into the discussion. Now, he’s logged over a year in space and that is crazy.
I think the exact number of days is 374.
Col. Nick Hague:
If you’re counting.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Yeah, if you’re counting. He’s an academy grad, he hails from Kansas, just a, a fantastic American. Welcome Colonel Hague.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Thank you, sir. I have to tell you, you’ve done a lot for us. We’ve got your coveralls that you provided to us, from O Mission.
On display, near the entrance. So I would ask the audience here on your way out. Make sure you take a look at that. It’s pretty, it’s pretty impressive. So, let’s get to it. Sounds good, sir. Okay. Well we’re gonna talk outta sequence a little bit, but your mission, last mission was in space last fall in September.
And, you commanded the SpaceX Crew nine launch from Cape Canaveral. Have you had time to reflect on the significance of what happened on that day?
Col. Nick Hague:
There’s nothing but time when you’re floating around the earth and inside the station, so, and it’s.
You try to process what’s happening in the moment, you are just really responding and you know, hey, your mission pivots, this is your new objective, and everything is focused on making sure that you can accomplish that mission successfully. Um, I, and just, you know, one thing that is like a glaring thing that I took away from just the, the lead up to the launch itself.
Was watching my crew mates. So for the better part of 18 months, I’d been training side by side with a crew of four, Zena Cardman, Stephanie Wilson, Alex Goroff. And, and when we had to adjust in order to create the space to be able to bring back, Butch Wilmore and Suni Williams, two of the crew mates had to be pulled off of that.
And, and so you can imagine. Stephanie has flown to space multiple times before she’d been to the Space Station. This was Zena’s first flight. Um, the buildup, the bonds, the friendship, the comradery that we had developed over those 18 months, and then in a moment to have that torn apart, and then to watch the professionalism of Zena and Stephanie to just jump right in because yeah.
We haven’t ever operated a dragon like we did with two, two people. Um, so if you think back to demo two, Bob and, and Doug flew up as a commander and pilot. They trained as a two person crew the entire time. This time around, Alex had trained as a mission specialist, had never sat behind the displays before.
He was in Russia when the decision was made, had no time to do any kind of delta training to be brought up to the level of a pilot. And so we launched with one person qualified to fly the fly, the spacecraft. Um, and so then it’s a ma matter of how do I figure out the crew resource management to, to do that?
Um, and Zena and Stephanie were instrumental in that. So. Decisions made on Friday. You’re pulled off the mission on Monday, we’re in the Sims together. They’re there with me helping me think through all the things that I need to think through. We spent an entire week sorting that out, how to operate as a two person crew, and then we all flew out to Hawthorne at SpaceX.
I. And then we, we worked with Alex ’cause he was finally able to get back from Russia and we figured out, okay, how do we, how do we make this work? And then we even threw in surrogates that had no training in the dragon to simulate Butch and sunny and, okay, how do you do that? And go through emergency procedures.
And so with two weeks of intense delta training, we were able to respond to that. So. The professionalism of the astronaut core, I think is, is the, you know, the US astronaut core, but just the astronaut community in general, um, is it was just on, on display and impressed me so much. Yeah. Um, but it has to be because space flight is so dynamic and it’s so, you just don’t know what’s gonna happen.
Right. Um, and if you look at my space flight history. I mean, everything is a surprise. It’s, it’s full of up and ups and downs.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
How do, how do you prepare? I mean, you talk about the professionalism, but do you train for this kind of last minute chaos, has to get organized and, and, and go
Col. Nick Hague:
Some of it’s expectations.
You, you, you train for the, the nominal. About 5% of the time, and then you spent 95% of the time training for everything that’s gonna go wrong. Right? Right. And so that’s kind of how you approach most problems. And, and, you know, surprising when you’re sitting on the, the launchpad and the, the T minus 10 is counting down, what’s going through your mind is, okay, what’s the next thing that I’m gonna have to respond to, to, you know, in an emergency situation.
So as you’re spending the nine minutes going to space. There’s moments where you’re appreciating the ride, and then the rest of the time you’re just thinking about, okay, what do I need to do to make sure that if anything goes wrong, I’m okay. My crew’s okay, and we can continue the mission.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Let’s talk about that.
Let’s go back. So 2018, your first launch. Yeah. You’re on the soils, a rocket and things are going fine. And then there’s, I guess the booster cides with, with the main body.
And the system automatically aborts the mission. Talk. Talk us through that. You end up safely in Kazakhstan, but
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
How is it,
Col. Nick Hague:
So to, you know, context. So I use capsule much smaller than a dragon. I’m elbow to elbow with my commander, Alex Chenin, who’s a veteran space flyer. He’s done a mission to the Space Station before he’s flown on the Soyuz. Um, and so the two of us are going up and, you know, it’s my first experience.
I really don’t know what to expect, and I’m strapped in and, you know, I. We lift off and, you know, from, from him saying, you know, Ali, which is, Hey, we’re going, and you know, that’s the words. Is that what that really means? Yeah. We’re on that way. Let’s go. Um, and you know, that’s what Guerin said when he launched.
And so they have, they’re steeped in tradition and so you’re part of that tradition. But he’s talking to me the whole way up, you know, Hey, this is, you know, this is normal. Oh, we can feel the vibrations. Everything’s good. And then we get to that first stage where we’re gonna drop those external tanks.
Um. They’re supposed to propel, propel themselves away, releasing some of their pressure and gas. One of them doesn’t do that. And so when you’re going 4,000 miles an hour, the slip stream’s pretty strong. And so it slammed that external tank back into the core stage kind of impaled it, but as it did, it tilted us enough that the automatic escape system since it’s time to get off.
And so some solid rocket motors inside of the fairing ’cause our launch escapes tower had already separated at that time. Pulled us off to the side. All of that happened in a split second. Oh, and so what, you know, what I’m trying to process is you hear the chunks of the normal. Separation and then all of a sudden there’s this violent side shake and a light’s flashing and the alarm’s going off.
And then there’s one little red thing that says rocket failure, and then you’re kind of tumbling. And so we were pointing pretty, pretty much straight up and, and so we continue from about the 30 mile mark to up to just over 50 miles just coasting up to the edge of space. And I remember looking out the window.
And going, you know, I guess I’m not gonna make it to the station today. Yeah. Um, and then we come back down and, you know, at that point everything’s fairly normal except for the G-Force we feel because we’re on a little steeper trajectory. Um, and the chutes open up and. You know, throughout that whole time, your mind does crazy stuff to you.
Time dilation is a real thing. Yeah. It seemed like we were weightless for all of a, a couple seconds, but it was actually four minutes. Um, it things just go by so quick. Thankfully we had a GoPro inside that was recording all of it, and so I was able to go back and watch it and, and relive it a little bit.
Col. Nick Hague:
Um, but you jump into your procedures, the training, the all the training for what goes wrong. We had simulated that, that type of failure, you know, kind of an in-flight rocket failure, about eight months before, it was one of our sim cases, that we did in Star City, just outside, outside Moscow.
So we had gone through and done the procedure and so instantly you’re in the procedure. What do I need to do in order to maximize my chance for getting back home to the family? Yeah, and making sure Alex gets back home to his family.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Well, it was a, it was a successful abort, safe landing. And they picked you up pretty quickly.
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah. The, we, we. The Swes has a, it is a, it is a controlled impact with the grounds, but it’s more like a slow speed car wreck going about 30 miles an hour. Okay. Um, you’re under a big shoot, it comes down, there’s rockets to the fire to slow you down a little bit more and then you bounce off the ground and we ended up on our side, um.
All the time that we were under the parachute, we were talking to the search and rescue forces. So the, the Russians stationed them all along our ground track, all the way from the bi cosmo drum to the Sea of Japan. And, and so there was fixed wing asset that as soon as we had aborted, they were launching.
We reported down the time. And so it’s, it’s not complicated math. They just said, well, this is when you aborted. This is how fast you were going, and this was the angle that’s where you’re gonna land. And so they just started sending people to that point. So within about 10 minutes, there were some pair rescue jumpers that, had dropped in and, pulled us out of the capsule.
And you know, it’s at that point when you’re sitting on the parachutes that the emotion of the situation Yeah. You can feel the shock just kind of wash over you.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Yeah. Yeah. Um, now you, you, you touched base, but you didn’t quite get there. Is that right?
Col. Nick Hague:
You know, people are really interested in how high you get when something like that happens.
I, I thought it was less relevant than I was still alive.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Very good point. Very good point. About five months later you did had a successful launch. You got
Col. Nick Hague:
Five months later and, you know, and I think that that’s, um. You know, space flight is an example, but I think, you know, service members understand this with all of their deployments.
Many times the person that is in the, in the action. Has less stress and less sacrifice than the loved ones that sit there on the ground. Oh, yes, yes. And so the first launch, my wife, my boys. Yeah, you know, my, my brothers, my parents, their wives, everybody’s out in by or to watch this. And so they witness all of that happening.
The second time around, you know, my wife Katie just went on her own. Yeah. And everybody stayed back in, in mission control in Houston and, and, and got talked through it all. But there’s, when you’re in the action, you’ve got some sense of control over your own fate. When you’re not, when you’re watching the person that you care about most sit on top of a rocket, there’s nothing you can do.
Yeah. Except sit there and watch. And so, um, the level of support that NASA puts into the whole person recognizing that the, you know, the, the, the. The psychological support, not just to the member, but also to the family is critical. And so from the moments of, of, you know, two days later, I was back in Houston after the abort to the five months before, you know, I.
There’s obviously a lot of discussions that Katie and I are having and we’re having with the boys, but there’s also, you know, professional support that’s provided by NASA to make sure that we’re processing all of that stuff and and that’s how you have that kind of resilience to try it again. Same, same launch pad, different rocket, same type of rocket, five months later,
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Successful outcome.
Yeah. Yeah. Hey, I wanna ask you a little, little different track here. Um. You know, about two thirds of NASA astronauts are service members from. Mm-hmm. And you were on a mission, it might’ve been your last one, I’m not sure. You had an Annapolis grad, you had a West Point grad and you academy grad. Mm-hmm.
So, just a general question, about is what’s that balance about that, that you have guardians also at nasa, you have other service members also at nasa? Yeah.
Col. Nick Hague:
So. The way that the astronauts are selected. There’s no quota, there’s no, we need to have so many military astronauts. It’s, it’s an application process that’s that’s open to any, you know, any US citizen.
That has an advanced degree and you have to have a master’s in a STEM field and you a couple years of work experience and you can apply. Um, so different than the origins of the space program where we were, you know, targeting the military population. Um, now and, and. For a long time it’s been open to anybody.
So I think it’s a reflection of the experience and the, you know, the investment that the service makes into developing their service members to, to have, you know, you can be really technically smart and that’s absolutely a part of the job. But the thing that really is the defining thing that helps you get selected and makes you successful at being an astronaut is how you deal with people.
Col. Nick Hague:
You know, and it’s not just leading people, but it’s just all those soft skills of how well can you take care of yourself? How well can you take care of your teammate? How do you handle adversity? How do you adapt to situations? Um, those things. We invest heavily in making sure that service members have those skills and so then that makes them very attractive. Yeah. To, to nasa.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
And you have the international aspect of that also, that adds a, a layer of complexity, I would think.
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah. And, and then you also, you know. For better or worse, we have opportunities in our careers to demonstrate those skills in stressful situations. And so, you know, if I’m, I’m an employer and I’m looking for somebody that’s done something close to what I’m gonna ask them to do to try to buy down risk.
’cause I know how they’re gonna be behave in that situation. Um, and, and military members have that opportunity not to say that civilians don’t have that opportunity. It’s, it’s just different.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Yeah. So, on your mission when you had a West Pointer in Annapolis and a and a US Air Force Academy threat.
Yeah. Was there service rivalry? Did you guys teach each other or are you just one team, one fight?
Col. Nick Hague:
Um, at the end of the day, it’s one team, one fight. But I was up there for six months with Bush and Sonny, and they’re both naval aviators and I never heard the end of it, so, um.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
I can imagine, well, you’re one of two guardians that have been in space.
Okay. And and we know that there are guardians all across the planet that are working very hard for, to maintain the safety and success of not just nasa, but other spacefaring organizations. Can you talk a little bit about that?
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah. You know, so the bottom line is that NASA can’t do its mission unless.
The Space Force and those guardians are doing their mission. So I’ve got a, a video here and I’ll kind of lead into it. So I’m not gonna give a quiz on the geography, but this is the West coast of the United States. There’s Edwards Air Force Base. Um, and, and so I. The biggest thing that I’ve noticed, and it’s the key example.
And so in the next frame you’re gonna see this nice Aurora, but I don’t want you to look at the Aurora. I want you to look at the stars. And then in the lower right hand corner, and it may show up on the side, I don’t know if it shows up there. You see these stars that are kind of dancing around like fireflies.
Well, those aren’t stars, those are satellites. And so you get this front row view of all of these satellites reflecting, you know, glinting, the sun’s rays as we’re getting ready to come over the sunrise and you realize that it is congested up there. And, and so that’s a very tangible demonstration of why NASA needs guardians doing their job.
We have a direct line from Mission Control out to Vandenberg. They’re constantly tracking those 48,000 objects up there, and when something comes too close, they let us know. And if it, if it continues to look like it’s a problem, then we move out of the way and. My first mission up there, I didn’t see this.
Oh, so six years ago you couldn’t see that kind of Yeah, I I I never saw that. Yeah. So in six years we went from open Skies and, and you know, it’s, you really didn’t, never saw another satellite to, now there’s hundreds that dance in front of you every time you get ready to come, you know, to Sunrise, which happens 16 times a day.
Yeah. And so you just, this constant reminder of. What they’re doing to make sure that we stay safe.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
That’s, that’s great. Um, so part of your work with NASA while in orbit, I’ve got some statistics here, especially from crew, nine, 900 hours of research, 150 science those experiments included everything from growing plants to testing stem cell technology.
It’s just, it’s fascinating how much work is done. And you took you were outside in space walking, doing repairs and other technical exploration and tests out there. What stood out as the most exciting science piece or technology piece that you worked on? Yeah,
Col. Nick Hague:
I get that question a lot. Like what was your favorite, you know, your favorite experiment.
And it’s really hard to to point to one because it is such, they’re so different. Yeah. And each one, you know, could have such a dramatic impact to life on the ground. But that’s why we’re up there. We’re up there to do scientific research on the station. The, the International Space Station is. Is this laboratory that we’ve been inhabiting continually for two and a half decades.
And so there we’ve, we’ve, we’ve built it and now we’re really starting to exploit its scientific capabilities. We’re doing, you know, up there doing DNA sequencing, trying to identify different microbes that we’re able to sample off the station to prove that that technology is useful. So pharmaceutical companies might wanna do that or stem cell research, trying to understand, are these stem cells more viable or more useful because they are cultivated in a weightless environment versus on the ground.
And, and subject to the pressures of, of gravity. Some of the ones that are, the ones that, that stick with you the most are the ones where you raise your hand and say, I’m going to be the Guinea pig and you can do your experiments on me. And so there’s about a dozen of those everything from you know, giving a little blood and then, and then, you know, analyzing all that blood to see what’s happened to my immune system while I’ve been on orbit.
Because we know that that life on, on orbit depresses your immune system response and we’re trying to figure out why.
Col. Nick Hague:
Um, others where we’re trying to come up with countermeasures for all that working out that we do up there. Yeah. The, the equipment that we use is, is really big. And as we go further into space, as we go back to the moon onto Mars.
Volume and mass are important. So how do I get rid of some of those really bulky experiments? So hooking myself up to, you know, electrode pads and, and shocking muscles and, and trying to use that to stimulate muscles and bone growth. Those are the ones that are the most tangible.
Yeah, but there’s so many up there. It’s hard to pick one. Yeah.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
It’s, it’s amazing how advanced that type of research has become in, in the use of space, in that environment.
Col. Nick Hague:
Some of it is just like, it’s science fiction. Yeah. You know, one of the last things I did up there as I was working on cleaning one of our 3D printers, and it was a printer that I installed six years ago.
It’s the Biofabrication facility. It prints human tissue. And, and so I, you help install it, you, you do some test runs on it, and then in the subsequent six years they have printed cardiac muscle and knee meniscus with the idea that I can print it up on orbit. It’s a more viable tissue than trying to 3D print it down here with hopes that someday I’ll print transplant organs and be able to send them down because on the ground when I print with a 3D printer.
The, the organ really isn’t stable until it’s whole. It needs to, it needs to grow in microgravity. How do we simulate microgravity on the ground? You know, at nasa we go to the neutral buoyancy lab and we go underwater and we float. How do babies grow? Yeah, they float. Yeah. And so we’re trying to simulate, okay, how do I build this?
How do I help it grow when we float? And so that’s the long term goal. Absolutely.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Fascinating.
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah. Science fiction.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Yeah. I don’t know if you know Paul Lockhart. He’s a, a two time challenger astronaut. And he brought back a lot of video from his missions that were just fun you know, bubbles of water being pushed through the weightless environment.
Mm-hmm. And I’ve been at his house in other presentations where children just go nuts over this stuff. They, they were able to see this environment that. Is often just simulated, you know, in movies and other things like that. But we’ll talk a little bit more about STEM and some education in a second place.
Okay. I do wanna get back to the families because I think you’ve taught us something that. We need to be thinking about the families, not just the astronauts. But you know, in our military careers, separation is a very difficult thing and on the ground here it is typically geographic in nature. Often communications mm-hmm can be iffy or non-existent.
So there you are, you know, 17,000 plus miles per hour going around the planet. How do you stay in touch and. What are the tricks? I mean, are there things that are better than other things?
Col. Nick Hague:
Um, some, some of it’s, it gets easier with experience. Um, in terms of the tricks, you know, I, over the years learning that constant communication, you know, Katie and I would, I, I’d wake up every morning and send her an email and.
Just, you know, it was, it was just a, a let it all out. Hey, here’s what’s going on today. Here’s something cool that happened that it surprised me about space. And then, you know, hey, here, here’s where I’m at emotionally and all the things that are going on. And so we’d have that and kind of prime a phone call.
And we’re spoiled. Lower orbit because we’ve got a communications network above us, the RA system, that provides us with ku comm coverage about 95% of the time, which gives me the opportunity to make an IP phone call or to do a video call pretty much anytime I want. And so the communication that connectivity is phenomenal.
And so just that constant communication, but also realizing that, you know, when you’re separated like that. Everybody’s lives continue to move forward. And, and it’s, it’s a, it’s a choice to make sure that as you move forward, you don’t move further apart, you move closer together and then making sure that the support that you provide you know the weekly medical conference that I would have where I’d get done with my flight docs, and then they would call Katie and kind of give their reports and say, Hey, hey, he’s, you know, these are the things that are going on. Or every two weeks we do a tag up with my psychologist and psychiatrist. And then they would, they would do the same thing.
And, and so the system is set up. To give you the, you know, to maximize the potential so that when you come back, reintegration is tough, but you’re set up for success at the end of the day.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Yeah. Is Katie’s a retired Air Force Colonel, right?
Col. Nick Hague:
She is.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
She is. How did that, was that a help? Was that a not a help that she had that background?
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah. You know, I think ultimately it was a help. It, it made it difficult as we were going along. There were many times where she was deployed and I was home or, or I was deployed and she was home. And, and so you have this shared perspective of, I, I know what’s going on on the other end. And so you are a little more in tune with that.
But it also made it difficult because there was a lot of time apart. There were, you know, we tried to be stationed together as much as possible, but given the nature of astronauts needing to stay in Houston, I got selected in 2013. So how do you spend 12 years in one location, but then still have a spouse that’s able to move around and, and so it’s difficult to, it’s difficult to juggle.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Yeah. Yeah. How about staying in touch with your guardian colleagues? Yeah.
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah. So one of the, um, it was, it was, you know, the first time I was up there I had this desire to like. You know, try to reach out to, to people that were supporting us. But it, it seemed very difficult. So this predates the Space Force.
Um, oh, right. Yeah. So my, my mission, my first mission predated the Space Force. Yeah. But this time, um, I. The space for the, the existence of the Space Force made it easier for me to engage. And, and so one of the things I did is, you know, every Wednesday or Thursday I’d just randomly pick a unit or an ops floor and just cold call ’em.
Hey, how’s it going? I just wanna say thanks. And, you know, we’re zipping around the earth and you’re keeping us safe. How’s it going on your end? And just chat. And some, some people wouldn’t believe I was actually who I said I was. Um, other people were thrilled and, and those were fun. You know, sometimes the comp coverage would let me talk for two minutes or three minutes, and sometimes we could talk for 30 minutes.
And those, those, those were fun times. It definitely, it lifted my spirits. I, you know, and I hope to do the same for them.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Sure. Hey, I’m Nick Haig. Send me some money. Is that, so you also stayed in touch, by the way. I want to thank you for this on behalf of the association here. But you stayed in touch with us last fall while in orbit on the, on the ISS.
You recorded a message for us that we showed in the big room at Airspace and Cyber Conference. We had you know, 20,000 people in attendance. The room was packed. And it was a tremendous message that you sent out, and it was especially important for the Polaris awardees. That’s the for the audience, that’s the mm-hmm.
Top guardians in the Space Force. They were thrilled with that message, so really appreciate you doing that for us.
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah, it, it’s, you just want, when you’re up there, you want to try to. You know, I wanna be able to say thank you and I wanna try to share the experience a little bit. Yeah. And we do all kinds of outreach.
Some of it’s not high tech, some of it’s ham radio and so we would do ham radio contacts on a kind of weekly basis, and that opened up. Parts of the world that didn’t have access to, you know, high bandwidth, right. Communications. And so we talked to classrooms around the globe and just asked answer kids questions.
Yeah. Fantastic. It’s a lot of fun.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Space Force turned five years old while you’re on the space station. And did you guys have a celebration up there or what, what did you guys celebrate?
Col. Nick Hague:
Well, you, you know, I forced the Navy guys to celebrate the Space Force birthday. Good on you. As it
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Should be.
Col. Nick Hague:
We had cake, so that was great. That’s great. Um, it, it, it was, it’s fun and you, you, you know, you have to plan ahead. When you’re, when you’re going up there, it’s, you gotta bring your own party supplies and that typically gets packed about six months in advance. Um, but it, in my stuff, I’m able to take up little souvenirs and things like that and, and I, you know, quite a few of those were space force related.
You know, one that comes to mind is the, you know, the sheet music for the Air Force or the Space Force song, um, San and it’s, it’s, um. It, it was, it was fun because I know there was so much work that went into, you know, it’s emblematic of so much work that’s gone into the first five years and in terms of establishing the space, you know, what does it mean to be a guardian?
And, you know, the, the song is, is part of that. Um. But it was also personally relevant because Katie, you mentioned, you know, so she was there in the thick of it as, as, as the, you know, the director for public affairs for the Space Force. Yeah helping all that come together. And so it was fun to, to be able to celebrate that a little bit, have that momentum.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Hey, so stick with this anniversary Space Force will turn six this fall. What’s your perspective on Space Force right now? In the first. Six years, five and a half years. I get
Col. Nick Hague:
There’s been so much. So much progress. Yeah. And it’s moving quick. Um, and it continues to evolve and, and move really quick.
I was, I was fortunate. Um, you know, I talked about trying to make assignments work out. I was, I was fortunate to, to be able to do a developmental rotation when Katie got assigned to come back here to DC I’d spent two years as the director of test and evaluation inside the Pentagon. Um, you know, as the Space Force is standing up and just the.
Progress that I’ve seen from some of the seeds that were laid in those early years and that we’ve been able is far surpassed my expectations. And it’s, I think sometimes when you’re in the thick of it, you don’t necessarily see it. But I go down to Houston and I get in this bubble and I’m focused on civil space and the NASA mission, and then I check back in after a year or, you know, a little bit longer with my.
With my colleagues and on the TE side specifically and hear about what they’re doing, and it just blows me away. Um, so I’ve, I’ve been so impressed.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Yeah. We had, our grand opening of this facility just recently. I. And Gen. Saltzman gave opening comments for that. Just he’s, he is the right man in the right place at the right time to lead the guardians and really influence all the services, but mm-hmm.
It sounds like, well let’s get back to, we were gonna talk a little bit about youth and STEM and
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Air and Space Forces Association has a STEM program and we run two competitions for kids in high school and some middle school Cyber Patriot, which is all about cyber. And then we have stellar, stellar explorers.
Mm-hmm. Which is a amazing space competition. And I got to judge that for the first time. I was blown away at what kids in high school. Can pick up in terms of the technology vernacular. Mm-hmm. The physics, it, it pretty impressive.
Col. Nick Hague:
I agree with you. I was able to, um, down in Houston a couple years ago give a talk to the stellar explorers that were down there.
Yeah. For the competition. Oh, good. They blow you away.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
It, it, it, yeah. It’s fantastic. So you had some STEM initiatives that you did, I think from ISS. Mm-hmm. Can you describe some of that? What were you trying to, you know, achieve
Col. Nick Hague:
Well. Ultimately, I’m just trying to get people to be curious, you know, get, get students to be curious about what’s going on and then, and then hopefully let them understand a little bit about why we do the space.
Sta why, why does the Space station exist at all? Um, and that’s where it gets into some of the, if you’re, if you’re talking to elementary students, you know, the, the real young ones, kindergarten, first grade, just showing them water floating around in front of you know. We’re all kids when we’re sitting there watching, and it’s like watching a flame at a campfire at night.
You just sit there and it mesmerizes you as it dances in front of you. Um, but that’s why we’re there because that’s the only place I can do an experiment where I can let something float. For years, you know, we go to great lengths and spend lots of money to be able to do you know, a drop tower test where we only get a, a second or two of time in weightlessness, or we do, you know, parabolic flights where we get maybe 20 seconds of weightlessness.
And this is a place where I can just take gravity outta the equation and, and see what’s going on. And then you stick your finger into that water. And then the surface tension of the water, just the adhesion, the water will just start to crawl up Your finger and water moves in these strange, you know, alien ways that you’re not used to because on ground gravity’s always telling it where to go.
And then when you let it have a mind of its own, it moves in strange places. And some of the experiments we do. We, we move water without pumps by just changing the shape of the channel that the water’s in, and it will wick its way through a system. And so you try to design a, you know, a water purification system that has fewer moving parts, so it’s more reliable so that we can go to Moon and Mars and not have to worry about complicated machinery breaking.
And so exposing them to that, taking something simple and then talking about that and then. Turning the camera and then looking at this complicated piece of machinery and saying, this is what’s possible. And then really just letting them know that there’s room for you in this, because space is a really hard business and it takes everybody, takes all kinds to do it.
Um, and if they’re interested, go for
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Hey, do you have advice you’d give to kids in college, high school as you know, if they want to pursue a career with NASA or in space, or. Yeah.
Col. Nick Hague:
You know, it’s an ex, it’s an exciting time. There’s lots of, there’s lots of, there’s lots of things going on.
If you just look at the NASA mission, all the things that we’re doing. As we transition from the International Space Station to commercial lower earth space stations and, and that transformation and, and how commercial companies are getting involved and then looking at the moon and all that’s required for that.
So there’s the big rockets that are gonna get there, the capsules that are gonna get us there. There’s lands that have to be developed. There’s rovers and new suits. All of this stuff is happening and. So it’s a great time if you’re interested in that stuff to get in. As you start on your path, wherever you’re at, understand that it’s not gonna be easy.
Um, I’ve, if I look back in, in my career, there are many times where I didn’t meet the mark. I, you know, I failed a test or I hooked a check ride, or I applied to, to test pilot school and got rejected. Or I applied to NASA and got rejected a couple times. Um, you’re gonna face adversity along the way. Understand that you are not gonna be successful completely on your own, and you’ve gotta.
Be able to reach out and ask for help. Um, and you’ve gotta be willing to give help to your colleagues be that good teammate and together you’re gonna be able to accomplish what you’re after.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Tremendous advice. Thank you for that. So this beautiful international space station.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Decommission of 2030, I believe.
What’s the legacy of that? That machine? Yeah.
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah. There’s. The thing that is, what I’m taking away from my experience up there the most is the international aspect of that. Um, as, as a, as an operator, more than I think any other position within the, the human space life program that we have within the nation.
As, as an operator, I get the privilege, I. To go and train. So it takes two years to train for a Space station mission, and a bulk of that is going to the highest fidelity simulators and equipment so that you can get the best training. And so the International Space Station has Russian modules and it has Japanese modules, and it has modules from the European Space Agency as well as the US modules.
And so those training facilities exist in. Houston in Scuba, Japan in Cologne, Germany, in Star City, Russia. And so you get to go to those places and then the people that train you there are the international training team, you know, so I’m being trained by, by Japanese and, and, and, and German and Italian and, and Russian.
Trainers and, and it’s over the course of two years. And so you get exposed into their culture and what makes them tick and how they think and, and you start to get this appreciation for just, it doesn’t matter which center I’m at, these, these, these teams of people, hundreds of people, thousands of people are dedicated, their lives are dedicated to.
Making the Space Station program work. And so it’s this, this unifying very positive mission of we’re gonna do research for the benefit of humanity that’s able to connect countries across the globe in spite of whatever’s going on and on the ground. We can come together and and do really great things.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Yeah. And what you say is such a thread from back, even in the Apollo. Yeah. Of of where these photos taken from space and the astronauts talking about no boundaries and you know, they see one earth, that type of thing. Yeah. Really is a heritage involved in space exploration, you
Col. Nick Hague:
Know, this overview effect.
Yeah. This, you know, a term that’s used for it and, and this idea of, you know, when you look at the earth, you see the geological features, you don’t see the boundaries. What what also frames it is that night sky. So that night sky, you see the, the air glow of the atmosphere of the earth. And, and, and essentially everything we know that’s alive is in that little thin layer over this sphere that’s below us.
And then the backdrop that you can’t capture in video like that. Just the sheer vastness of the universe and how many stars, and it just, it clouds up the entire sky. And you understand just how precious our, our little planet is and how we’re really all on it together.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Well, that’s fantastic and I hope you take me next time you go up.
I’d like to be part of a
Col. Nick Hague: Deal.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Um, one last question, then we’re going to some audience questions, but General Saltzman will probably want you back in the space for us sometime soon or, or what’s the future for you?
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah. So you, the, you land I’ve been focused about the so on, on orbit. When you’ve got this schedule we’ve got our daily schedule and there’s a red line and our, our days are scheduled up there in every five minute increment.
And so you’ve got seven people’s schedule and there’s this red line, which is current time and it’s racing along, and you’re trying to get everything done before the red line gets to the end of the day. And so you’re really focused, you know, it’s not even like a 50 meter target, it’s like what’s right at your nose, and just trying to make sure you get that done.
Yeah. When you, when you get down you know, after splash down, then there’s like two months. So I can open my horizon a little bit more. Two months of intense rehabilitation trying to make sure that you get your body back into shape and then a lot of debriefs with the program to try to get lessons learned.
And then you start. After that, about a four month window of being able to go out and share your experiences with the public. Um, and that’s, that’s, I’ve, I’ve opened my aperture to, to four months out at this point. At the end of that, I check in with the, the chief astronaut and get my marching orders, see what happens.
Yeah.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Well thanks for spending a piece of time with us in this discussion. And so we’ll move to some audience questions. And what I’d ask you to do is we’ve got pass around mics. Wait for the mic. And talk into the mic. And before you ask your question, please give us your name and where you’re from.
So. First question goes to about here she’s with there in Air and Space Forces Magazine.
Unshin Lee Harpley:
Good morning, Karen, peace Forces Magazine. Morning. Um, you talked about these fascinating experiments that you’ve done on ISS and I’m curious what are some of the lessons that you’ve learned from these NASA missions that can be applied to the Space Force going into the future and also.
I’d love to hear, um, what your vision is for the Space Force’s future collaboration with nasa, especially when it comes to crude missions. I don’t think, you know, the guardians have ever been to the space before, so,
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah. You know, and ex when you, when you think about. What NASA needs to do on a, on a daily basis where we’re doing operations in space and the space station is essentially 95% remote controlled.
So think of the, the crew on board as doing only the things that the ground can do. So if the ground can figure out a way to do it, they’re gonna take it away from the crew and we’ll focus on doing other stuff. A great example of that is we used to robotically capture all of the cargo vehicles that that came up.
And that’s because it’s a dynamic operation. You’re there, you know, it’s stick and rudder kind of stuff with a robotic arm. You’ve got a Greyhound bus out there floating around within, you know, 10 meters of the station and you don’t want it to hit and you reach out and you grab it. Now we automatically dock a lot of those cargo vehicles so that the crew doesn’t have to do all of that training, doesn’t have to do that dynamic operation.
And that frees us up so that we can do the things ground can’t do, which sometimes is monotonous. It’s, it’s moving bags from one place to another and, and supplies some. Sometimes it’s just. The overhead of having humans on orbit. So a lot of the stuff we do has to do with our regenerative environmental systems.
How, how we process water, how we process urine, how we process the air that we breathe, all of that stuff is because we’re out there and so we’re trying to keep ourselves alive. Um, but that operational mindset and the way you approach that problem set is a different environment. Then what you see on a Space Force ops floor.
But you’re, I mean, you’re doing the same thing. You’re remotely operating systems, and, and so one of the things that we work on is, is how do we collaborate on sharing lessons learned across those, across those envi, those environments? And, and so we’re at the, the beginning stages, you know, and, and we’re fortunate within, within the Johnson Space Center to have a small footprint of guardians that are there.
And are getting checked out on console in mission control to be able to, to experience and take that experience back to the Space Force and share that and cross pollinate those ideas. And so I think that’s the, that’s the level of collaboration we’re at right now. I’m excited to see that continue to grow and, and we’ll see where it goes from there.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Right here.
Amanda Bresler:
Good morning. My name is Amanda Bresler and I’m with PW Communications. I’m curious how they control the flow of news and current events when you’re in orbit for a few reasons. Obviously the natural emotion that might come with learning about things that are happening, happening on Earth. Mm-hmm. You guys are in a precarious situation, so do they control that?
And then obviously the international component of your colleagues where things happening on the ground might drum up political sentiments. How, what is the flow of that information and is there a protocol or is it just kind of. Your wife knows not to mention things. How do they manage that?
Col. Nick Hague:
In, in large part, um, there is no censorship that occurs.
I talked about the teacher system providing us with that 95%, you know, coverage. I’m able to access the internet. Stream any new service that, that I want to up there, that really the only limiting factor is my time. I’m so busy up there, you know, I might miss something that’s going on. Um, but, there, there is no intent to shield us from that.
Um, that, that leads to, you know, interesting conversations amongst crew members. And that’s where those interpersonal skills are really critical. Um, but I’ll tell you that, you know, the. The fact that you’re up there and your life depends on your crew mates doing things and, and trusting that they’re gonna do the right things at the right time.
I never question that. And it doesn’t matter if it’s, if it’s, you know, Sonny or Butch or Don or Alex or Yvonne or Alex. I mean, they’re, you know, close friends and colleagues and I trust them with my life.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Wow. Well said. It’s a bias from the Air and Space Forces Magazine.
Tobias Naegele:
Thanks, Stutz.
So I’m really curious about how we make space exciting for the future generations. I remember whole school assemblies watching launches, Apollo launches, and making models. And, I, Neil Armstrong played a key role on my seventh birthday because he landed on the moon at my party. Um, it was part, it was a, there was a sense of ma, national purpose, and it was part of the national spirit.
And today most Americans don’t even know there’s a space force. How do we bridge that and how can the Space force learn from nasa? Because one thing NASA has done well is be an ambassador for interest in space. How does the Space force build on that?
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah. A huge part of my job is, is, is doing outreach, you know, um, at the beginning of that four months, but even after that four months.
Roughly 10% of astronauts time US astronauts. Time is, is to do public outreach. And I can tell you that the excitement’s there, so it’s not, how do we get people excited about it? Um, I think it’s, to your point, we need to make sure that they’re aware of it. It doesn’t matter where, what audience I go to.
The questions just start coming out and, and the curiosity just starts coming out. And this idea of the potential of space and the things that we could accomplish just naturally starts to come out. And it doesn’t matter if it’s kindergartners or if it’s college students or if it’s a group of civic leaders.
Excitement’s there. So how do you share awareness and bring it into focus And, you know, NASA here in, in five months is, is getting ready to launch four. My friends around the moon, um, I don’t know if it’s five months, don’t quote me on that but here in the next 12 months for sure, we’re Artemis two’s going around the moon.
And so that’s gonna be a really big spotlight to bring some of that focus to this idea. But. There’s so many o opportunities out there now, especially in commercial sector, for people to get involved with space. I think it’s an obligation that the, the whole industry needs to take on to just help, you know, bring that awareness out there.
Um, the excitement is baked in to society.
Tobias Naegele:
Yeah. So if I could make a quick follow, what could we at a FA or our industry friends and partners do? To really make that, um, a a more, to make people more conscious and I mean, really the broader American people, more conscious of the Space Force and, um, why we need, why space exploration is important.
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah. You know, that’s the, that’s the, that’s the million dollar question. I think it’s gonna take some out of the box thinking. And, and so let’s do some real time out of the box thinking you guys should sponsor a submental flight for K through 12 students and have a national competition and draw that spotlight.
But my personal opinion,
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
But you want me to go on this, right? Yeah. Okay.
Col. Nick Hague: Yeah. Again.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
What else? I think I, yeah, please. Right here.
Mark Lukowski: Thank you. My name is Mark Lukowski with J International. I’d like to ask you about your personal experience. I don’t know other word, acquisition or acclimation cultural experience going from a gravity planet to. Something the first time they opened that, that airlock the experiences that you felt. And whatever you can think of the impact.
I’m thinking like when you first had to dream the first night, was it difficult to sleep? Did you think I can, I’ll never. Do you have a dream? I can’t get that pen. It floated away from me. Anything like that that you can describe to us? Thank you.
Col. Nick Hague:
Yeah. So I have dreams in, in that are based in zero g. I have dreams that are based in gravity.
Um, I have dreams based on my experiences when you first get up there, I. There’s so much stuff that’s changing inside, in as you’re adapting to, to the zero G environment for the first few days. Space motion sickness space adaptation, sickness. You know, essentially your eyes are telling you one thing and your inner ears telling you something completely different.
It takes a few days before your mind kind of rewires everything and just stops listening to your inner ear. And then, then everything works out but there’s so much stuff that changes. So the first time I went up there, roughly 45 years old, I figured, Hey, I’m over 40. Everything’s set in stone. It’s only downhill from here in terms of me.
And, and the reality is. You are so adaptable. Everything changes. Um, you know, I, I grow so the gravity’s not compressing my spine. So my spine straightens out and, and decompresses a little bit, and I grew an inch and a half to two inches on orbit. Um, you know, I’ve rewired the way that I’m perceiving vertical up there by just using visual cues.
The other, the other thing that happens is my mental projection of the behavior of everything around me changes. So slowly after about a month or so, I started expecting things to behave like they’re in zero gravity versus one G. The best, best example is that subconscious aspect. So if you’re gonna throw a ball, you know, if I’m gonna throw a ball across this room.
When I first get to orbit, every time I throw it, I hit the ceiling because I am playing gravity to pull it back down. After a while, I start throwing it just in a straight line and I, I figure that out. And so then subconsciously I start to, to pull that in. And then I see the reverse when I land. If I take off a sweatshirt and I throw it on the bed, all of a sudden it just like slams into the bed.
Like it weighs 300 pounds. And it’s because I kind of expected it to float a little bit more. Um. Your skin changes so calluses on your feet, I, I floated for seven months or six months, and so I wasn’t using the bottoms of my feet and so those calluses just slowly fluff off and, and, and the caught by the air conditioning system and filters, so you don’t have to worry about all that.
It, but parts of space are not so clean. Um. But what I did use my feet for was to hold me in place. And the way I’d do that is there’s handrails all over the place. And so I hook my foot underneath the handrail and I lift my big toe. And so slowly, I, my, I migrated the calluses from the bottom of my feet to the top of my big toe, because that’s the skin that I was using.
Um, everything changes when you, when my immune system changes. If you cut yourself, it doesn’t heal as quickly. Hair tends to grow faster, nails tend to grow faster. All of this stuff changes and then it goes back when you get back to the ground. And so your, the lesson that it taught me is all the little micro decisions that we make on a daily basis that expose us to the environments around us.
Shape who we are. We’re always adapting to what we are subjected to. Um, but that, that’s one of the, the thrills. Yeah. I mean, some of it’s painful growing, you know, stretching the spine was fairly, you know, intense back pain for about a week and a half before it subsided so it’s not all fun and games, but it is.
It teaches you a little bit about yourself and about humanity. It’s pretty good.
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
We have one last question right here, and then we’ll be out of time.
Audience Question:
My name’s Mike. I’m a tax preparer and a, um, my question is what do you think is ultimately more important the research performed aboard the International Space Station or the technological spinoff that comes from building the infrastructure of having a man space flight in lower orbit?
Col. Nick Hague:
I’m not sure in my mind I separate the two. Um, I look at it as this, this objective of. Trying to gain knowledge, knowledge about ourselves, knowledge about our universe and, and, and how we interact with it. And some of that is the exploration aspect where we’re pushing the boundaries further and going to places we haven’t been before.
But I’m doing the same thing inside a laboratory. I’m pushing the boundary of what we know, trying things we haven’t done before, and seeing what works and what doesn’t. Fundamentally, you know, when I talk to elementary students, the most powerful question is why? Why does something happen? Why does it, you know?
And just keep asking why, and you’ll get some answers. And then that’ll lead to more questions, and that propels us forward. So it’s the pursuit of knowledge in my mind. I don’t really separate the two out
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
That’s. I gotta say this has been a tremendous discussion, but we have to bring it to an end, unfortunately.
Boy, thank you for spending this precious time. Um, thanks for your service in the defense of the nation and also for your service to all of us on this planet. You thank it’s been a tremendous, I
Col. Nick Hague:
Thank you. I, I’ve got ave brought some, I’ve got a little, I got a little gift. Okay. I got, I told you I was able to take a few things up.
So, um, I wanted to share one of those things with you. Um, so to the Air and Space Force Association, a Space force flag that flew with me on the International Space Station. Outstanding. Thank you. Round of
Maj. Gen. Stutzriem:
Well, good luck to you. Thank you. We hope to have you back sometime. Absolutely. And everybody, don’t forget we’ve got his coveralls out there on display. And that’s it for today. Thanks for this warriors in Action and we’ll see you next time. Thank you!
